View Full Version : Advertising on Farkin
skinner
14-09-2006, 02:03 PM
Just wondering why you dont let overseas online bike shops advertise on these forums, unlike the Aussie ones.
In many cases not metioning any names bike the advertised "online" shops are overpriced and understocked. Where as at least one US online bike shop that i know of which gives very good service and the best prices and international shipping costs are not allowed to advertise here. WHY?
No i know we all hate ads but these are really usefull when trying to find gear.
just a my 2cents anyway.
thanks for a great forum guys
Not "allowed" to? Or they just haven't asked to put an ad up? The banner ads here are all paid for, and paying advertisers are allowed to use the Sponsor Specials forum. We give a BIT of leeway to people announcing new products provided it's not just blatant spam (still waiting on the 100% official/concrete terms here, I know) by letting them put up press releases and whatnot. To my knowledge, there are no international advertisers because they simply haven't tried to advertise here. If there is a no-overseas-advertising policy, I missed it (seriously - if I have, somebody correct me).
No Skid Marks
14-09-2006, 05:24 PM
It would be bad if this just became a fascist interactive infomertial,I'm sure a new site would spring up and most Farkiners would go there if thought control through one sided forums became the norm here. Freedom of speech makes Farkin what it is,not advertising. If it's about money then just charge us all to use Farkin.
I don't think blatant spam is as hard to see as advertising lies for most people.
As for overseas advertising,well it's not Farkins job to save the Aussie bike industry and the for sale section possuibly hurts the market as much as forign shops. Most users on here feel responsible enough to help out the Aussie industry and would be outraged at forign advertising. Without bike shops we would all be screwed even if you could get stuff OS it'd still be lame.Look at it as a charity for the Aussie industry,and be happy next time you need a tube or part in a flash.
demo man
14-09-2006, 05:55 PM
this will end in tears, i can just see it!
nest up someone will be arguing that bike stores are businessed and that we shouldn't have to give them charity, they should work for our money. Then someone will argue that it's not so much charity towards the store as the whole culture and industry, and even more importnat the sport within australia.
and it will never end....
It would be bad if this just became a fascist interactive infomertial,I'm sure a new site would spring up and most Farkiners would go there if thought control through one sided forums became the norm here. Freedom of speech makes Farkin what it is,not advertising. If it's about money then just charge us all to use Farkin.
I don't think blatant spam is as hard to see as advertising lies for most people.
As for overseas advertising,well it's not Farkins job to save the Aussie bike industry and the for sale section possuibly hurts the market as much as forign shops. Most users on here feel responsible enough to help out the Aussie industry and would be outraged at forign advertising. Without bike shops we would all be screwed even if you could get stuff OS it'd still be lame.Look at it as a charity for the Aussie industry,and be happy next time you need a tube or part in a flash.
I'm having trouble understanding your point, sorry. When you say As for overseas advertising,well it's not Farkins job to save the Aussie bike industry are you suggesting that we SHOULD have foreign advertisers... and ergo we obviously have a policy restricting that?
Because the truth is nowhere near that. There is NO Farkin policy restricting advertisers to those companies based in Australia and as S. stated above the only reason there are no foreign based companies advertising on this site is the fact that they haven't chosen to.
And I'm totally lost about your first paragraph... so if you'd care to reword it I'd gladly try and address any concerns you have or at least bring them to Scott's attention.:)
No Skid Marks
14-09-2006, 06:14 PM
My first parragraph was in reply to Ss about Spam etc. I was just trying to express that I think it would kill Farkin if advertisers have a say in how it's controlled,it is an open forum and I feel that if people were to get shut up cause they're discussing the merrits of a non advertised bike then eventually the Farkin members would move on. I'm not implying at all that this is the case and can respect the sensitivity of caterring for advertisers and the awkward situation of spam.
I wasn't saying we should or shouldn't have forign advertising,i was trying to offer two view points. It's doesn't matter really at this point anyway especially as there's no rule and no forign advertisemnets.
If I'm still not making sense then please feel free to just delette both these posts as I was trying to help, not make waves.
Eh? Control? Advertisers get a banner ad, a spot in the sponsor specials, and the ability to have new product releases etc mentioned in press releases if they so choose. They sure as hell do not have anything to do with censorship of this forum, in any way, shape or form. They never have, and unless Scott gets bought out at some point in the future, they never will.
olly1oo6
14-09-2006, 06:29 PM
Most people ive seen attempting to promote their products, who are not paying advertisers of the forum, get shut down pretty quickly.
Overdone?
Certianly
cater for your paying advertisers all you want, but I don't think its appropriate to label everything else as "spam"
No Skid Marks
14-09-2006, 06:31 PM
I said if it went that way not it was that way. Doesn't matter I have no desire to persue a debate here,I was making some hyperthetical points not statements.I don't know how Farkin works or if the advertisers request stuff,so I'm outta my league and shouldn't have bothered saying anything.
Most people ive seen attempting to promote their products, who are not paying advertisers of the forum, get shut down pretty quickly.
Overdone?
Certianly
cater for your paying advertisers all you want, but I don't think its appropriate to label everything else as "spam"
hahaha. Nice sig, funny you'd mention that.
If I'm still not making sense then please feel free to just delette both these posts as I was trying to help, not make waves.
No I never thought you trying to make waves... all good. I really was just trying to understand what you were getting at.:)
Cheers
Most people ive seen attempting to promote their products, who are not paying advertisers of the forum, get shut down pretty quickly.
Overdone?
Certianly
cater for your paying advertisers all you want, but I don't think its appropriate to label everything else as "spam"
Overdone? I think 5 identical threads promoting a sale at a shop that just happens to appear in your sig may be classed as overdone, eh?;)
And tell us what would you appropriately label as spam then?
And while you're at it, tell us why someone from that particular shop (the one featuring in your sig) thinks it's OK to use this forum (that costs MONEY to run) to promote their own business (so as to put MONEY into their own pocket), but not pay for that the way many other business are prepared to? :rolleyes:
olly1oo6
14-09-2006, 07:20 PM
I wouldn't be mentioning it if I thought it was appropriate. I think it was overdone, and it certainly wasnt the only incident I have seen on this site. I wasnt referring to that particular incident, so I apologise if it came out that way.
[Edit: the reason I wasnt actually referring that incident was because I didnt see it at all, before action was taken, so I can't necessarily comment]
Also, the person posting that information had approached farkin more than once regarding advertising on the site, with no response given. too busy? overlooked? possibly, but the fact remains that Belrose was willing to pay for advertising on the site, had you been kind enough to warrant them with a response.
edit2: can anybody tell my why I lose text everytime I edit a post? it just dissapears:(
I wouldn't be mentioning it if I thought it was appropriate. I think it was overdone, and it certainly wasnt the only incident I have seen on this site. I wasnt referring to that particular incident, so I apologise if it came out that way.
[Edit: the reason I wasnt actually referring that incident was because I didnt see it at all, before action was taken, so I can't necessarily comment]
Also, the person posting that information had approached farkin more than once regarding advertising on the site, with no response given. too busy? overlooked? possibly, but the fact remains that Belrose was willing to pay for advertising on the site, had you been kind enough to warrant them with a response.
edit2: can anybody tell my why I lose text everytime I edit a post? it just dissapears:(
Surely you're not saying that a lack of response about paid advertising made people at that particular shop think it was OK to spam these forums? Please have "the" shop in question contact me directly via grip@farkin.net and I will pass it on immediately. Rest assured I will be ensuring that Scott (who is the only one able to arrange advertising here) knows about this ASAP. If they still want to advertise I'm sure it can be arranged. After all, there are LOTS of other companies that have somehow managed to arrange it, eh?
But I'm intrigued by what you think is OK then. You say that any efforts by non-paying advertisers to promote their products on the forums are shut down quickly. Can you please explain why you think that's wrong?
olly1oo6
14-09-2006, 08:39 PM
Surely you're not saying that a lack of response about paid advertising made people at that particular shop think it was OK to spam these forums? Please have "the" shop in question contact me directly via grip@farkin.net and I will pass it on immediately. Rest assured I will be ensuring that Scott (who is the only one able to arrange advertising here) knows about this ASAP. If they still want to advertise I'm sure it can be arranged. After all, there are LOTS of other companies that have somehow managed to arrange it, eh?
But I'm intrigued by what you think is OK then. You say that any efforts by non-paying advertisers to promote their products on the forums are shut down quickly. Can you please explain why you think that's wrong?
Yeah fair enough. Again, I cant say anything about what methods were used because I dont actually know, so if it was seen as inappropriate I do understand. I will let Belrose know to contact Scott in particular, as they may have tried to go through a different channel.
maybe its just more of a general consensus, that of users too, but many people seem all to happy to scream "spam" at anything that promotes another shops products. I dont think it should be censored in the way of "paying" vs "non-paying" because that disadvantages the users from having a full range of products to choose from in their decision process. Of course, "payers" get the advantage of banners, and sponsor specials, news, press-releases anyway; but "non-payers" should still be allowed to use general or other forums to subtley and politely endorse their products.
Again, it really is up to you guys, so I guess I shouldn't be whinging, but I think maybe it should at least be accepted that "non-payers" occasionally plug their stuff.
johnny
14-09-2006, 08:53 PM
Non-payers do get to occasionally plug their stuff. I'm sure you've seen the Lahar thread, yes? THere are many like this that do it at a minor level and are allowed. But we get shops like Clarence Street and others alike that pay to advertise sales on this site. If they see fools like Mr. Belrose Cycles spamming (yes, posting the same thread 5 times over is spamming in anyone's language) and getting away with it, they will stop paying and do the same. Then we have no money to run the site and you start paying for membership. Simple business stuff. We have to protect our interests which allow us to protect yours.
It all depends on how the thread is presented, in my view.
If a member posts "hay guyz look at this cool stuff" and just posts pics of their new gear, it's a pretty crap thread regardless of if they're promoting their own product or not.
A dud thread doesn't help anyone, all it does is give a chance for mindless kids to post "looks hot", "looks smooth" or "nice, got a price?", which is all a waste of space.
A better way to approach getting the product attention is to be constructive in the promotion and discussion of said product. Something more along the lines of "Check out this gear, it's intended for X riding and we've produced it with Y philosophy in mind", which then plants a seed for analytical discussion and constructive criticism.
This is just my view, I'm swayed toward tech-geeky discussions as they're pretty interesting to read and learn from. Blantant product pushing is just abusing the services that a small bunch of people have worked very hard for to create, but to me involving the forum members in discussion and product feedback is a good thing and I'm happy to see it happen (as long as it's not abused).
Because of my above thinking, I'm happy for anyone to shoot down those that post what I consider a "spam" thread (ie, blatant promotion with no seed for discussion). Get on the attack early, rip in to their product. If they can't defend themselves, well, too bad, they shouldn't have been wanting free attention anyway... if they can come back with a decent explanation and a decent discussion forms then all the better for everyone and hopefully they'll post their next thread with a different approach.
For what it's worth I reckon the situation is fairly simple...
If someone asks a question about ANYTHING to do with a particular product or service then it's absolutely fine for a business to reply regardless of whether or not they are paying advertisers.
If someone asks a question looking for advice about something/anything and a business thinks their products/services could help then it's absolutely fine for them to answer.
What Farkin does NOT allow is non-paying advertisers to SPAM the boards by posting up totally unsolicited info about their products and services - for instance there was a shop just yesterday (that does not advertise) and simply posted 6 identical threads in 6 different forums advertising a sale they are having. That was totally unsolicited and very clearly "spam" and was dealt with quickly and appropriately.
Every business, regardless of whether or not they are paying advertisers, also has the ability to send the mod/admins a product review or press release that WE can put up in the news or press release sections if it's deemed news-worthy and/or suitable.
I hope this clears it up and by the way.... Farkin WANTS industry and shop people contributing to the forums and appreciates product info etc... as I said above though, it's the unsolicited spamming that isn't wanted.
Cheers
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