View Full Version : Honda's Official 04 MTB Race Team
Honda has publicly announced it's official 2004 MTB race team.
Along with the already signed Greg Minnarr will be the addition of Cyrille Kurtz who threw down a convincing 3rd at the Worlds in Lugano in the Jr event.
Honda's team will be directed by 23 Degree's head man Martin Whiteley.
For more information visit the below link for the official press release.
<a href="http://www.velonews.com/race/mtn/articles/5530.0.html
">Velonews.com</a>
The Honda mountain bike team is testing on the gold coast at the moment. Three mechanics were putting together about 8 bikes yesterday and by the size of the rest of the boxes there was possibly another 8 or so bikes to be assembled , all the bikes looked the same apart from saddles and pedals . they are using the gold coast honda motor bike shop as there base during testing. I'll try and get some pictures today.
so Minnarr is on the goldcoast ? where are they going to actually ride the things ?
I dont Know if Minnar is over here ,the mechanics dont speak english. I'll go and get some photos , the riders may turn up today. Its a big operation i was very surprised by the amount of gear they had even for a world cup team.
Tenacious Doug
13-02-2004, 10:46 AM
Exciting stuff, sounds like a lot of bikes and a lot of kit. Any pics yet?!
bazza
16-02-2004, 09:37 PM
get some exclusive pics! and steal the blueprints while your there! hang on just take a bike! awesome stuff though!
Kingswood
23-02-2004, 09:40 AM
These guys where testing at Tambo last week, big set up with tents, mechanics, about 6 or so bikes maybe, lotsa people.
I didn't get to see anyone ride, One guy who I talked to didn't even like me looking at the bikes, was a bit of an arsehole considering they were set up in a public place, at a popular track, which I have put many hours into maintaining etc etc.
I didn't hang around, so I didn't get a really good look at the bikes, or riders. Was unwelcome as it was so definately no photo's.
Bunyip
25-02-2004, 10:39 PM
Has anyone seen pics of the Honda drivetrain, I heard its internal and (i'm not sure how this works) a "gearbox" style drivetrain.
stiksandstones
04-03-2004, 03:57 AM
These guys where testing at Tambo last week, big set up with tents, mechanics, about 6 or so bikes maybe, lotsa people.
I didn't get to see anyone ride, One guy who I talked to didn't even like me looking at the bikes, was a bit of an arsehole considering they were set up in a public place, at a popular track, which I have put many hours into maintaining etc etc.
I didn't hang around, so I didn't get a really good look at the bikes, or riders. Was unwelcome as it was so definately no photo's.
Way to keep the few fans we got psyched on the sport, treat them like peasants!
I hope this tale is not true, because, in all reality, we dont need motocross attitude in MTB's...all private and top secret. This is a multimillion dollar industry, not a multi billion dollar industry-like motos, we can afford to be alittle relaxed eh?
Yeah thats crap .... they should of been like g'day ... mate and meet mr Minnarr .. Greg seems like a top bloke he would like to meet people.
Not like you were going to jot down their untested unproved prototype suspension and make your own team.
Snobs.
Acadian
04-03-2004, 07:33 AM
Yeah thats crap .... they should of been like g'day ... mate and meet mr Minnarr .. Greg seems like a top bloke he would like to meet people.
Not like you were going to jot down their untested unproved prototype suspension and make your own team.
Snobs.
Minnaar who? :roll: :wink:
Honda is in one of those positions ... Most teams need to pimp their riders .. to make a name , get the kid interested, make the kids want to ride ( intense, Giant ) Instead honda do not plan to make their secret weapon's available to the public .. so they dont really need to pimp the name. Not like people dont know who Honda is ???
Basically they sign up the world champ .. which they have and put up heaps and heaps of posters .. saying Minnarr world champ on Honda .. Bobs your aunty they are a big player in the MTB world even though they havent sold a bike.
I still disagree with all the top secret shit .. fair enough they want to keep journo's or other industry tech people away .. but some dude riding the same DH as them in a public area near his own home ??? thats crap.
Kingswood
04-03-2004, 09:09 AM
I hope this tale is not true
I shit you not mate!
DEVLIN
04-03-2004, 09:38 AM
Just a quick welcome to stikman.
I have just scanned a short article out of Mountain Biking UK. Didn't put the big picture of the bike up as split the page and the top half wouldn't upload. This one in the article was in all polished finish. Looks farkin sick.
I am sure taht I read some where that they cost US$75,000 each. I don't think you will see production of the team bikes, rarely do, but we might be lucky enough to get a 'detuned' version.
http://www.farkin.net/forums/album_thumbnail.php?pic_id=5129 (http://www.farkin.net/forums/album_pic.php?pic_id=5129)
luckyphil
04-03-2004, 10:09 AM
75.000 !!!!???? sure u dont mean 7,500?
DEVLIN
04-03-2004, 11:03 AM
Nup. I think what they were reporting was the development costs for doing the six prototypes. Obviously if they went into production of that exact bike the unit cost would come down. It would still be expensive as they would only be able to sell so many bikes and that is the only bike in their range, at the moment.
Just to make the moulds for pressing the moncoque shapes would be up in the tens of thousands of dollars if not over a $100,000. So all of that adds up by the time they put in man hours and one off production costs. I guess now they have the mould each bike would be cheaper unless they change the design which could require a new mould. Then the moulds also wear out after time so they have to be replaced. So as you can see costs add up which means they have to sell a lot of them to get any money back.
Sparkman
08-03-2004, 02:37 PM
Apart from all the secretive crap, I wonder if Honda will revolutionize DH bike design. Apart from the funky gearbox, they have also developed the suspension independently of the MTB world (using Showa I think).
They also say that the gearbox weighs about the same as a standard drivetrain- nice.
I just remember Honda dominating F1 racing and just about everything they have a go at.
luckyphil
08-03-2004, 04:22 PM
umm, ferrari?
Fkahb
08-03-2004, 04:24 PM
Umm two wheeler F1s - (500cc)
Apart from all the secretive crap, I wonder if Honda will revolutionize DH bike design. Apart from the funky gearbox, they have also developed the suspension independently of the MTB world (using Showa I think).
They also say that the gearbox weighs about the same as a standard drivetrain- nice.
I just remember Honda dominating F1 racing and just about everything they have a go at.
I think their approach will blow a bit of fresh air into mtb design. It looks to me like they've basically started from scratch to design a bike for purpose X, and gone about it in the best way they can think of, using their motorbike design expertise as what looks like the primary background. Notice how the bike has no linkages or floating brake, and ignores conventional chainline design in favour of a simpler setup to minimise chain growth. Personally I don't think the bike will perform as well as it could, to begin with, but I reckon Honda will work out pretty quick what any glaring problems in their design are, and mix in their own ideas with conventional mtb "wisdom". And thus the refinement begins.
DEVLIN
08-03-2004, 05:53 PM
Why don't you think it will perform? Is it because it is so new and coming from a non mtb back ground?
Scott
08-03-2004, 06:02 PM
history.... not many brand new things are ace when they first produced... usually after a couple revisions they'll turn out to be good.
Why don't you think it will perform? Is it because it is so new and coming from a non mtb back ground?
I think some things will be sub-par (probably geometry and possibly pedalling and braking) because Honda have no experience with this stuff before, whereas things like suspension, stiffness, gearbox performance and strength to weight will probably be at least as good as anything out there today. And given the amount of money they can put behind the program without a second thought, they can probably fix any problems as they're noticed by the riders. I very much doubt the bikes at the end of the season will be identical to the ones raced on at the start of the season, because companies who can throw that kind of cash around, can get stuff done FAST.
All speculation though :)
The biggest worry though is it won't be compatible with Sockets grip shift. :wink: :D
Sparkman
08-03-2004, 06:18 PM
Maybe I'm just showing my age, but Honda dominated F1 the four wheeled variety back when anyone driving a Williams (like Damon Hill) was nearly unbeatable due to the Honda engine. Then when Honda decided to pull out of F1, the field was levelled and eventually Ferarri and Schumacher started to win.
I'm sure it will take a couple of iterations before Honda gets it right, but with a few world-class riders giving feedback, I think things will mature pretty quickly. Given they used motorcycle based design packages, the RN01 is probably not the ultimate DH bike... yet.
CHEWY
08-03-2004, 06:23 PM
they have also developed the suspension independently of the MTB world (using Showa I think).
Kayaba actually, they swapped all their bikes over a while back.
The biggest worry though is it won't be compatible with Sockets grip shift. :wink: :D
ahaha, they probably have some telepathic semihydraulic shifting that does away with the need for a clumsy physical shifter and focuses your eyes for you to boot.
DEVLIN
08-03-2004, 07:00 PM
Good points socket. I reckon the geometry is a given that it won't be quite right. They have already raced it succesfully in Japan but Minnar is probably going to want his own feel. I think pedaling is going to be the big one. One of the advantages of a bike like...say...an Orange is you gain a little bit of sprinting ability by the wheel being forced into the ground. The Honda doesn't have this so I tend to think this is where it may suffer. I reckon the brakes will actually be to powerful. Which tends to be Hondas way, more is better. But as you said, it is all specualtion from us.
Good points socket. I reckon the geometry is a given that it won't be quite right. They have already raced it succesfully in Japan but Minnar is probably going to want his own feel. I think pedaling is going to be the big one. One of the advantages of a bike like...say...an Orange is you gain a little bit of sprinting ability by the wheel being forced into the ground. The Honda doesn't have this so I tend to think this is where it may suffer. I reckon the brakes will actually be to powerful. Which tends to be Hondas way, more is better. But as you said, it is all specualtion from us.
I was thinking more along the lines of brake squat than braking power, I reckon the brakes will be awesome. It's about time some *real* brake manufacturers got in on the MTB scene. But yeah I reckon it'll pedal like a giant mushy turd (could be wrong however!), I don't think there'd be anywhere near enough pedalling anti-squat.
vBulletin® v3.7.4, Copyright ©2000-2008, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.