2007 Australian Worlds Team

[Scott]

Junior
Downhill
Joel Bain (Mt Nasuru, WA 24.09.1989)
Caroline Buchanan (Kambah, ACT 24.10.1990)
Joshua Button (Boambee, NSW 25.11.1989)
Mitchell Delfs (Gracetown, WA 25.07.1989)
David Hetherington (Delacombe, VIC 16.07.1989)
James Maltman (Stretton, QLD 02.03.1989)
Tom Patton (Belrose, NSW 14.11.1990)
William Rischbieth (Aldgate, SA 03.12.1989)

Cross Country
Peter Braunsteins (Kew, VIC 24.02.1990)
Nathan Haas (Deakin, ACT 12.03.1989)
Paul Van Der Ploeg (Tawonga South, VIC 09.11.1989)

Elite
Downhill - Elite Men
Sam Hill (QLD 21/07/85)
Nathan Rennie (QLD 31/05/81)
Michael Hannah (QLD 21/11/83)
Chris Kovarik (QLD 01/03/78)
Bryn Atkinson (NSW 09/12/82)
Jared Graves (QLD 16/12/82)
Amiel Cavalier (NSW 24/03/87)
Jared Rando (ACT 22/06/81)

Downhill - Elite Women
Tracey Hannah (QLD 13/06/88)

4X – Men
Jared Graves (QLD 16/12/82)
Amiel Cavalier (NSW 24/03/87)
Jared Rando (ACT 22/06/81)
Bryn Atkinson (NSW 09/12/82)
Michael Hannah (QLD 21/11/83)
Luke Madill (NSW 28/05/80)

4X – Women
Caroline Buchanan (ACT 24/10/90)

Cross Country - Elite Men
Chris Jongewaard (SA 18/07/79)2007
Sid Taberlay (TAS 22/01/80)
Dylan Cooper (ACT 30/06/79)

Cross Country - Elite Women
Tory Thomas (VIC 02/09/78)
Dellys Starr (VIC 02/10/76)

Cross Country – U23 Men
Shaun Lewis (SA 14/08/86)
Daniel McConnell (VIC 09/08/85)
Lachlan Norris (VIC 21/01/82)

[Dozer]

Umm, when will the junior teams be released? :confused:

[Scott]

When someone sends me the press release :)

[Dozer]

I know you have better contacts and more insider info than that..........:p
Cheers bud.

[Squidly Didly]

Umm, well will the junior teams be released? :confused:
Are you talking about this (http://forums.farkin.net/showthread.php?t=83343&highlight=junior+worlds+team) Junior Worlds Team that was announced here (http://www.cycling.org.au/Content/NavigationMenu/News_and_Media/CA_Memos/070418WorldJuniorMTBTeam.pdf)?

I do have a question though... Is there a reason why our womens National Champion isn't on the team? Not taking anything away from Tracey as she's an absolute pinner, but are we only limited to one female representative, or is there more politics behind this?

[casey79]

With close to 8000 posts between you both I would hope you know how to search. :eek: :rolleyes:
Here are 2 links:
http://forums.farkin.net/showthread.php?t=85771&highlight=junior+worlds+team

http://forums.farkin.net/showthread.php?t=83343&highlight=junior+worlds+team

[casey79]

[QUOTE=Squidly Didly;1040777]Are you talking about this (http://forums.farkin.net/showthread.php?t=83343&highlight=junior+worlds+team) Junior Worlds Team that was announced here (http://www.cycling.org.au/Content/NavigationMenu/News_and_Media/CA_Memos/070418WorldJuniorMTBTeam.pdf)?

QUOTE]

Beat me by minutes.

Im sure it says somewhere on the CA site that being nat champ does not garantee you a place. You also have to prove your worth on the world stage. Nothing against Foxy (she is a champ in the local scene and one of the only girls pinning it at all the local races) but she did come second at the champs. But got it cause the chick who one was not Australian.
Yes traveling OS need a lot of $$$$$ without a sponsor, but plenty of the guys bite the bullet buy a ticket to the states and race the NORBAS. The current head coach (Sharpels) for one way back in the day did it.
It does suck for Foxy though. Just my two cents dont flame me pylet boys and girls.

[Scott]

Just got a 2nd release, updated post with Juniors now listed.

[Dozer]

Are you talking about this (http://forums.farkin.net/showthread.php?t=83343&highlight=junior+worlds+team) Junior Worlds Team that was announced here (http://www.cycling.org.au/Content/NavigationMenu/News_and_Media/CA_Memos/070418WorldJuniorMTBTeam.pdf)?


Ahhhh yep, that's the one!:o

[alchemist]

I do have a question though... Is there a reason why our womens National Champion isn't on the team? Not taking anything away from Tracey as she's an absolute pinner, but are we only limited to one female representative, or is there more politics behind this?

Did she meet the selection criteria?


10. SELECTION CRITERIA – ELITE WOMEN DOWNHILL
10.1 All Elite Women DH athletes wishing to gain selection to the National MTB team for the 2007 MTB World Championships must demonstrate their ability to compete at the elite international level by attending a minimum of two (2) UCI major races (World Cup, Maxxis Cup, NORBA, French Cup, Swiss Cup, Sea Otter) in the 2007 season prior to 9 July;
‘OR’
Have their competition schedule for the period 1 May until the 2007 MTB World Championships approved by the National Coach.
10.2 Attendance at the 2007 Australian Mountain Bike Championships will be a selection prerequisite for all elite women DH athletes in accord with Section A, Clause 4.3.

10.3. The National MTB Selection Committee will determine Elite Female DH athlete selections based on the following criteria:10.3.1. Performance benchmarks will be used as indicators of potential international competitiveness and therefore grounds for selection.

10.3.2. Performance benchmarks for Elite Women DH athletes will include International podium (1st, 2nd, or 3rd) results. Performances from previous seasons and in particular previous MTB World Championships may also be considered.

10.3.3. For the Elite Women DH athletes, a performance benchmark of 130% of the Elite Woman’s winning time from approved events, may be used.

10.3.4. The 2007 Elite Women’s National Champions will be given priority for selection to the National MTB Team.

[Squidly Didly]

Im sure it says somewhere on the CA site that being nat champ does not garantee you a place. You also have to prove your worth on the world stage. Nothing against Foxy (she is a champ in the local scene and one of the only girls pinning it at all the local races) but she did come second at the champs. But got it cause the chick who one was not Australian.
Yes traveling OS need a lot of $$$$$ without a sponsor, but plenty of the guys bite the bullet buy a ticket to the states and race the NORBAS. The current head coach (Sharpels) for one way back in the day did it.
It does suck for Foxy though. Just my two cents dont flame me pylet boys and girls.
All valid points, but I'm still confused at why the decision is how it is. Foxy was prepared to cough up the coin to fund her own way to Fort Bill. Which brings me to this bit again...
Not taking anything away from Tracey as she's an absolute pinner, but are we only limited to one female representative, or is there more politics behind this?
Considering the last Champs (http://forums.farkin.net/showthread.php?t=62071&highlight=World+results) in Rotorua had 3 girls (Claire, Emma, and Sarah) representing the senior category, I can't see why we only have 1 this year? As far as I know (and correct me if I'm wrong), but neither of these 3 race the Norba Circuit?

[G-Man]

Not flaming you but , But ...

Why contest the national scene at all if it isn't going to get you
anywhere - hell we may as well write Australia Off as far as MTB goes and
just sent her o/s next year to contest there norba series - i dont think so,
she is Super proud to be an Aussie so will race here in Aus not because she wants a free ride but because she loves it and the scene needs women riders
here - not o/s all year round ..

And on the racing o/s note to show your stuff - how did Emma make it to NZ over Foxy last WC in NZ not hitting one round b-4 it all season - again dosent make sence - maby it's a Foxy thing :( ..

If you know her she is one tuff girl so she'll bounce back no worries but what
it all comes down to is --- Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm Gee - what does this do for the sport in AUSTRALIA = Nada ..

For instance ::
Howmany more people picked up rugby when we got the WC how many
people started to watch and play soccer when we got into the WC ..

How many more girs would get into the scene seeing Foxy rippin it up
and she is still real you can actualy ride with her on any given weekend ..

I guess cycling is different ..

End rant ...

Peace love and Kisses folks thanks for the support for Foxy - two years
running now and two years dreams shattered ..

[casey79]

Gman didnt know that you and foxy where going to shell out the coin to get over. In that case the reasons not being selected must be pretty thin.

7 girls could have been selected this season. Sure 3 girls where selected last year cause the race was in NZ.

[the F.H.B]

The first person I looked for on the list was Foxy, she has trained super hard over the last 18 months to get where she is now skill and fitness wise and Im incredibly disapointed and angry she's not on the list.

Is it possible to hear from someone in mtba as to why she wasn't picked? I for one would love to hear their reasonings.

[Booost]

Sam Hill QLD? I thought he was a WA boy.

[BOBCATZZ]

What happend to to Alex LLoyd last years highest ranked aussie at the 4x and probably the only one with enough UCI pionts to make it .
Im sorry but to me it seems unless you are now travelling the tour there is no spot for you .And stupid me thought we were trying to encourage and nurture our talented youth oh well i suppose if your already got the big sponsers and on the big teamsit doesnt matter.
MY TWO CENTS

[Ryan]

I'd say Lloyd is in the same boat as Foxy, has the national results but hasn't raced internationally over the last season so hasn't considered by the powers that be.

[mazzer]

Sam Hill QLD? I thought he was a WA boy.i was thinking the same thing :confused:

[big ral]

Sam Hill QLD? I thought he was a WA boy.

And aren't both Bryn Atkinson and Chris Kovarik from Vic?

[Squidly Didly]

And aren't both Bryn Atkinson and Chris Kovarik from Vic?
Nope......

[luke.b]

Gees, Kovarik's getting a bit old. :p

[pyley]

ok, i'm not sure what the rules are, but i wonder if it would be at all possible to send the people who have earnt it over to the worlds. Go over the heads of cycling australia and mtba and just pay thier way!

looking at the previous post regarding selection criteria, is that for the aussie team or world champs??

Anyway the guys from pylet are more than willing to band together to get our girl oversea's!

note: she also finished 5th at oceana's, i believe second aussie home behind tracy.

as for the state of mountain biking..i think if you have an athlete that is capable of competing on the world stage and and is willing to everything to get there, but , is not too cashed up and not able to afford to race oversea's to gain the 'correct credentials' for an aussie team,but, has proven her ability,something needs to be addressed... it's not the monetary side that needs adressing it may be the criteria itself... where does the criteria originate?

if you have the answers for me pls pm me...

[Heppla]

Sam Hill QLD? I thought he was a WA boy.

Must be the state of birth.

[BOBCATZZ]

Easy to get international xperiance when your never given the chance as i say if lloydey and foxxy had the big dollar sponsers then would they have been chosen.As i see it alex beat the whole 4x team except Luke who may have uci bmx commitments so go figure.I know for a fact that alot have people chased the national series and dedicated them selfs to do what ever they were told to do to make the team i suppose they musnt know the right click.
Just thinking i have seen barnsey actually axe a few of the 4x team and hes like 100 so if we dont want to show the world the best we have fuckit pick me ill go.
N#G@A PLEASE

[jwin]

Sam Hill QLD? I thought he was a WA boy.

Sam is definitely 100% West Australian born & bred !

[barnesy]

Can anyone really tell me the 4X team is the best we can send ? Our mens downhill team is awesome ? But for the majority, the 4X team just looks like " We'll we better give these guys something to do on their days off" (some obvious exceptions).. And don't give me the "international experience" crap. Lloydy got second in the Nationals (beating all your 'international experience' riders), he then won the UCI event at Thredbo, and was the only Aussie to make the finals last year at Roturua ( with a week and a halfs notice and still suffering from glandular fever ). He did everything possible you asked of him and you still shit on him because he is not in the click. Just like Foxy!! They saved their money, got the results and trained hard. Only to be overlooked by a selection process based on not how you have performed but who you know. So... #1A Womens DH and #2A Mens 4X have not been picked, how do you really explain that? To all our young riders, don't bother going to the Nationals next year, just spend your money drinking and hanging with the right people and go overseas. My apologies to the riders, it's the selectors I'm shitty with..

[Hellie]

I appreciate the gripes with the selectors not picking the Aussie champ to go to the Worlds, and trust me , I would like nothing better than for Tracey to have more Aussie girls to ride with over there. She has great fun with Joanna. Tracey didn't do the Nats or the Nat series as we literally couldn't afford to keep sending her down south for races. What I don't appreciate is the assumption by most of you that to be selected you have to be a big team sponsored rider. Tracey is not, and has not, been sponsored since she started racing. During the 'off' season she works part time in a bike shop, and trains. The only reason she is doing the World Cup series this year is due to the generosity of the Polc family, (accom & travel), the help of Orange UK (bikes) and the sale of some of the bikes we had from Mic. Tracey has worked really hard to get where she is, and is still not sure she'll be able to do it again next year. I'll get off my soap box now.

[tadders]

amen barnsey

[Night_Train]

BEST LOOKING TEAM BIKE EVER

http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n106/luke_mclellan/l_2bdb41d3ff6b4411dcb7f055047d0f8a.jpg

[Az]

BEST LOOKING TEAM BIKE EVER

http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n106/luke_mclellan/l_2bdb41d3ff6b4411dcb7f055047d0f8a.jpg

ahh Patton's new weapon!!! noice but prefer the blue & orange one (plus now it mine :D )

[GDonehue]

Can anyone really tell me the 4X team is the best we can send ? Our mens downhill team is awesome ? But for the majority, the 4X team just looks like " We'll we better give these guys something to do on their days off" (some obvious exceptions).. And don't give me the "international experience" crap. Lloydy got second in the Nationals (beating all your 'international experience' riders), he then won the UCI event at Thredbo, and was the only Aussie to make the finals last year at Roturua ( with a week and a halfs notice and still suffering from glandular fever ).

I write this having just finished doing our appeal for one of our riders on non-selection and I have to say I can see the point here. Our appeal is based on the criteria and to be brutally honest, I wouldadmit that our rider might not beat Alex - yet we have been able to show how he meets the criteria (although whether it is to a level that satisfies the review panel remains to be seen).

Lloydy has not only shown time and time again that he can match it with the best in Australia, he has beaten people who are matching it with the best in the world. It isn't fair and the criteria is based around the presumption that everyone can ride overseas (sponsored or not). The criteria for 4X is also out of date, citing events that no longer exist and still placing NORBA up on a pedestal that it no longer deserves. Half a NORBA 4X field would be lucky to make a final in the Czech Cup or at some of the other Euro events. I think what is missing is the ability to make a 'coaches decision'. I am sure that Scottt Sharles would love to have Lloydy there, but at the end of the day it is not his decision alone to make.

[Night_Train]

Still a couple more bits of custom squidtrickery to go ;)

good on ya squid

[Squidly Didly]

good on ya squid
Heh, so I delete my last post just as you quote it haha. Oh well, here's his helmet. Aussie pride!

http://forums.farkin.net/attachment.php?attachmentid=75352

[Night_Train]

Heh, so I delete my last post just as you quote it haha. Oh well, here's his helmet. Aussie pride!

http://forums.farkin.net/attachment.php?attachmentid=75352

did you do this yourself squid or did someone else cause that is the kind of qaulity i want my new TLD to be :D aussie pride

[junior]

the guys at www.kickasskuntoms.com painted my helmet and the smurf's were designed my my mate at DGdesigns. you can look at all his other latest drawings on www.myspace.com/dgeen .

[Night_Train]

the guys at www.kickasskuntoms.com painted my helmet and the smurf's were designed my my mate at DGdesigns. you can look at all his other latest drawings on www.myspace.com/dgeen .

ive got his myspace its sweet mad guy and does some awesome stuff good luck tom

[Incontinent]

ok, i'm not sure what the rules are, but i wonder if it would be at all possible to send the people who have earnt it over to the worlds. Go over the heads of cycling australia and mtba and just pay thier way!
Not possible, you have to be selected

note: she also finished 5th at oceana's, i believe second aussie home behind tracy.
Probably had to get third to be considered

as for the state of mountain biking..i think if you have an athlete that is capable of competing on the world stage and and is willing to everything to get there, but, is not too cashed up and not able to afford to race oversea's to gain the 'correct credentials' for an aussie team, but, has proven her ability,something needs to be addressed... it's not the monetary side that needs adressing it may be the criteria itself... where does the criteria originate?
The selection criteria is performance based with regard to potential podium results, money and/or backing really has little to do with it.

if you have the answers for me pls pm me...


Just ride and have fun.

[pyley]

oi oi oi..stay on topic guys...

[casey79]

Even though Foxy did come 5th. I was close to 50sec of the pace of the winners. I would think that CA would want a better showing than last year with all of the elite women well of the pace. Thus have only picked riders with a realistic chance of being up near the pointy end instead of being cannon fodder.
Compared to the men where all of the guys finished in the top half of the pack. With an impresive five in the top 15 riders.
Yes everyone loves an underdog. But you have to fit the criteria.
If the appeal does not work the best thing Foxy can do is get enough UCI points (20 at the moment) or be a part of a trade team (you can start your own like team USA Decline), ride at the Canberra World Cup and show why she sould have been picked.

Also pyley this a Worlds Team in general thread, not just a Why didnt I Get Picked thread. So showing us team bikes is cool with me.

[Squidly Didly]

oi oi oi..stay on topic guys...
This thread in particular is about the Worlds Team so it is on topic Mr Pyley.

[MJR82]

The Selction criteria is not worth the paper its written on. Doesnt matter wether its mtb,bmx,cycling etc. Its up to the discretion of the 'selectors' who they feel will get the results. Wether these 'selectors' make the correct decisions or not, is at times questionable.

This is just a personal opinion. The important thing is to go out and ride the best you can and enjoy yourself!

[the F.H.B]

Well as I've stated earily in the thread, Im very disappointed with the Team selection made, Here is a quick summery of my reasonings.

Do the selectors really want 4x to die? By their choices you would have to think so. If top riders spend their own coin to go to the national rounds, they should be rewarded for their efforts. Guys like Terry Scarr and Alex Lloyd rode well all season and beat pretty much everyone on the list yet they dont get on.
Conversely you have riders on the list like Mick or Bryn who put the 4x behind the Dh in order of preferance getting the big chance.
Here is the current 4x world rankings according to the UCI, It shows pretty clearly who's putting the effort in
http://www.uci.ch/ucinet/uci.asp?page=results&discipline=mtb&ryear=2007&ridercategory=me&l=eng

We all know the Joanne Fox situation is a joke and she should be in, so instead im going to tell a little story on missing out...
Back in the day I was a stong Sport climber, my training goal was to compete in the (Asian)X games one day. In 2000 I finally got the chance after finishing 3rd in the national series. When I when to the Sport climbing Federation they said they had decided not to send a team so I would have to wait till the next year. (they decided we weren't good enough, even though I was consistantly beating the climber who came 5th the year before.)
I accepted this (I was unbelievably pissed off but what could I do...) and started training for the next year. 2 weeks after the first comp of 2001 I ruptured my PCL, effectively ending my Climbing career, I never did get to the X games...

I guess the moral of the story is people have dreams, and they strive to make those dreams happen. In a sport like Mountain Biking there is only a limited window of oppertunity to get to the top, you have to take that chance while you can because you never know what tommorrow will bring.

Mtba's job is to get the best possible representative team to Fort William, they are failing to do that, they should explain why.:mad:

[Dozer]

Mtba's job is to get the best possible representative team to Fort William, they are failing to do that, they should explain why.:mad:

CA picks the riders, not so much MTBA.

[the F.H.B]

CA picks the riders, not so much MTBA.

Ok Then, CA :mad:

[G-Man]

Even though Foxy did come 5th. I was close to 50sec of the pace of the winners. I would think that CA would want a better showing than last year with all of the elite women well of the pace. Thus have only picked riders with a realistic chance of being up near the pointy end instead of being cannon fodder.
Compared to the men where all of the guys finished in the top half of the pack. With an impresive five in the top 15 riders.
Yes everyone loves an underdog. But you have to fit the criteria.
If the appeal does not work the best thing Foxy can do is get enough UCI points (20 at the moment) or be a part of a trade team (you can start your own like team USA Decline), ride at the Canberra World Cup and show why she sould have been picked.

Also pyley this a Worlds Team in general thread, not just a Why didnt I Get Picked thread. So showing us team bikes is cool with me.

Good Call we have already go tthe wheels in motion for that ..

Any hoo - like incontenant said We'll Just Ride and have fun ..
She & I are much calmer today so what ever comes - comes ..

Catch yas

G-man outy

[ronning]

Easy to get international xperiance when your never given the chance as i say if lloydey and foxxy had the big dollar sponsers then would they have been chosen.As i see it alex beat the whole 4x team except Luke who may have uci bmx commitments so go figure.I know for a fact that alot have people chased the national series and dedicated them selfs to do what ever they were told to do to make the team i suppose they musnt know the right click.
Just thinking i have seen barnsey actually axe a few of the 4x team and hes like 100 so if we dont want to show the world the best we have fuckit pick me ill go.
N#G@A PLEASE

Firtsly llyod wouldnt touch graves... however alex possibly should have made the team because he rode well in the aussie series.

I'm not sure who barnesy is but the courses overseas are a fair bit more technical and having a good gate start does not get you in the team.Most of the picked riders have performed competitivley on the international arena.

It hasnt nothing to do with dollars

[ronning]

Well as I've stated earily in the thread, Im very disappointed with the Team selection made, Here is a quick summery of my reasonings.

Do the selectors really want 4x to die? By their choices you would have to think so. If top riders spend their own coin to go to the national rounds, they should be rewarded for their efforts. Guys like Terry Scarr and Alex Lloyd rode well all season and beat pretty much everyone on the list yet they dont get on.
Conversely you have riders on the list like Mick or Bryn who put the 4x behind the Dh in order of preferance getting the big chance.
Here is the current 4x world rankings according to the UCI, It shows pretty clearly who's putting the effort in
http://www.uci.ch/ucinet/uci.asp?page=results&discipline=mtb&ryear=2007&ridercategory=me&l=eng

We all know the Joanne Fox situation is a joke and she should be in, so instead im going to tell a little story on missing out...
Back in the day I was a stong Sport climber, my training goal was to compete in the (Asian)X games one day. In 2000 I finally got the chance after finishing 3rd in the national series. When I when to the Sport climbing Federation they said they had decided not to send a team so I would have to wait till the next year. (they decided we weren't good enough, even though I was consistantly beating the climber who came 5th the year before.)
I accepted this (I was unbelievably pissed off but what could I do...) and started training for the next year. 2 weeks after the first comp of 2001 I ruptured my PCL, effectively ending my Climbing career, I never did get to the X games...

I guess the moral of the story is people have dreams, and they strive to make those dreams happen. In a sport like Mountain Biking there is only a limited window of oppertunity to get to the top, you have to take that chance while you can because you never know what tommorrow will bring.

Mtba's job is to get the best possible representative team to Fort William, they are failing to do that, they should explain why.:mad:


Terry didnt go so well in the last world cup did he. I think some of the women qualified faster than him and he was out in the first round.

UCI ranking no way a means to pick the team. Alex llyod accrewd all his points by racing the aussie series. You guys have to remember MOST of the top riders don't even attend these races. Jared's first UCI point scoring race was the national titles in which he would have won bar unclipping in the final.

Give guys like Bryn and Rando some respect.

[thecat]

If selection went purely on local results Cadel Evans would never have been picked on the XC team...


I can see where they are coming from in terms of the MtnX team but leaving Foxy off the womens team and only sending 1 rider is baffling at best.

[24alpha]

Can someone explain why CA are pulling the strings? I would have though MTBA would be the governing body even though the 2 are associated.
And was there a press release regarding the team selection?

[thecat]

Can someone explain why CA are pulling the strings? ?

UCI only recognize 1 body/country. CA is it here.

[...jim]

UCI only recognize 1 body/country. CA is it here.

Similar story when it comes to the apportioning of Government funding from the Australian Sports Commission.

[GDonehue]

Terry didnt go so well in the last world cup did he. I think some of the women qualified faster than him and he was out in the first round.

UCI ranking no way a means to pick the team. Alex llyod accrewd all his points by racing the aussie series. You guys have to remember MOST of the top riders don't even attend these races. Jared's first UCI point scoring race was the national titles in which he would have won bar unclipping in the final.

Give guys like Bryn and Rando some respect.

Terry has raced well in the Felt Cup last weekend - a UCI points race. He dropped it in Qualifying at Schladming as did a bunch of riders. That said he also finished in the top 50% of the pack overall, which puts him above two of the team members in the 4X team in terms of their World Cup rides. There are no UCI points for the Aussie series (I think) - they came from the Oceanias and the National Championships. Terry, Lloydy, Luke Strom all beat Rando there and Amiel. Lloydy and Luke also beat Bryn. I am not saying that this 'means they should be on the team' but I would argue that those three riders are a match for some of the world's best when given the opportunity.

[BOBCATZZ]

Terry didnt go so well in the last world cup did he. I think some of the women qualified faster than him and he was out in the first round.

UCI ranking no way a means to pick the team. Alex llyod accrewd all his points by racing the aussie series. You guys have to remember MOST of the top riders don't even attend these races. Jared's first UCI point scoring race was the national titles in which he would have won bar unclipping in the final.

Give guys like Bryn and Rando some respect.
1st MADDILL 2ND LLOYD 3RDBRYN 4TH JARED dont know about cant touch still he had to beat maddill but jareds os perfermances warant him being there as he is taking 4x seriously.Also this the track of the worlds 09 there for is the best 4x track au has to offer

[BOBCATZZ]

Firtsly llyod wouldnt touch graves... however alex possibly should have made the team because he rode well in the aussie series.

I'm not sure who barnesy is but the courses overseas are a fair bit more technical and having a good gate start does not get you in the team.Most of the picked riders have performed competitivley on the international arena.

It hasnt nothing to do with dollarsLLoydy was the only aussie to make it to finals last year at rotarua a track that scared the shit out of most riders so u are right the tracks are different

[the F.H.B]

Terry didnt go so well in the last world cup did he. I think some of the women qualified faster than him and he was out in the first round.

UCI ranking no way a means to pick the team. Alex llyod accrewd all his points by racing the aussie series. You guys have to remember MOST of the top riders don't even attend these races. Jared's first UCI point scoring race was the national titles in which he would have won bar unclipping in the final.

Give guys like Bryn and Rando some respect.

I have never given the likes of Jared or Bryn anything but the uttermost respect, which is something you could learn judging by the first sentence of your post.

If you refer back to my post you will see that I stated that it was a question of prorities, I believe the DH team is picked on merit, Im struggling to see that merit on the 4x team.

I took the time to go through UCI records from the beginning of the year, in that time I have Mick down as doing 1 4x event, 1 UCI sanctioned race all year. He was down for 2 others and had DNS's, can you explain that?

I could go on, things like Amiel being beaten by Scarr and Lloyd at every round during the national series come to mind fairly quickly but the fact is I doubt it will change anything...

Oh yeah except the fact that Australia's shooting it's own chances in the foot, and when these guys give up on doing the national series because lets face it, it's limited returns for a serious outlay, then it's the sport that will suffer.

[junior]

Loyd's tracksuit pants are'nt gonna cut it in fort william.....

[wilba]

go rub some vagisil on..

[ronning]

LLoydy was the only aussie to make it to finals last year at rotarua a track that scared the shit out of most riders so u are right the tracks are different


NNNEEEERRRR. No he was the only rider to go into the second round. I think only a handful of boys actually raced after a bad run of injuries leading up to the race. Bootes had a broken nose, Jared broken wrist etc and i'm sorry but graves is in another league.

Hannah, Rando and Bryn have all had big results on the international scene. Scarr and llyod have not!!!! You cannot get picked for a WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP team after competing in a half assed series. Maybe next year they should do what all the picked guys on the team have done in the past and put there lives on hold and prove themselves on an international scene.

It is worth noting that although they have named 8 men DH riders only 6 will race and less than 6 will actually race 4x.

The same thing is gonna happen with selection with the olympic bmx team. Whilst most people(in public) will lay there judgements from races in australia the team will mostly be chosen from international events. UCI supercross, american uci races and of course the upcoming world championships and maybe in tight situatiuons thay would look to the likes of Australian UCI events or Pro BIX.

I do hope Madill rides he does have the class to do well and has proved himself at a international level.

[GDonehue]

NNNEEEERRRR. No he was the only rider to go into the second round. I think only a handful of boys actually raced after a bad run of injuries leading up to the race. Bootes had a broken nose, Jared broken wrist etc and i'm sorry but graves is in another league.

Hannah, Rando and Bryn have all had big results on the international scene. Scarr and llyod have not!!!! You cannot get picked for a WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP team after competing in a half assed series. Maybe next year they should do what all the picked guys on the team have done in the past and put there lives on hold and prove themselves on an international scene.

t is worth noting that although they have named 8 men DH riders and 6x that is not the amount that will actually compete. I think in the men only 6 can ride Dh and less in the 4x.

The same thing is gonna happen with selection with the olympic bmx team. Whilst most people(in public) will lay there judgements from races in australia the team will mostly be chosen from international events. UCI supercross, american uci races and of course the upcoming world championships any maybe in tight situatiuons thay would look to the likes of Australian UCI events or Pro BIX.

Exactly what International 4X results has Madill had..? Being National Champion did not appear to make much difference to Foxy...

Funny as it may sound - Lloydy's Oceania result, whilst gotten here, is an international result. This is why it gets so many UCI points. And speaking of half assed series - have you seen the results at NORBAs and who is riding 4X? Take out the top three at all but one round and you aren't left with a lot of quality... So maybe we should be giving more credit to our half assed series.

[ronning]

Exactly what International 4X results has Madill had..? Being National Champion did not appear to make much difference to Foxy...

Funny as it may sound - Lloydy's Oceania result, whilst gotten here, is an international result. This is why it gets so many UCI points. And speaking of half assed series - have you seen the results at NORBAs and who is riding 4X? Take out the top three at all but one round and you aren't left with a lot of quality... So maybe we should be giving more credit to our half assed series.

Pull your head in.Anyone can see Luke Madill would quickly cut his teeth and be a contender at a Worlds in 4x and is an exceptionto the rule.

We do not want moto fill

[GDonehue]

It is worth noting that although they have named 8 men DH riders only 6 will race and less than 6 will actually race 4x..

I think it is 7 DH spots and 7 4X spots

[thecat]

I think it is 7 DH spots and 7 4X spots

But only one Chix. The question remains why isn't Foxy going?

[roxy12]

But only one Chix. The question remains why isn't Foxy going?

rather disinheartening isn't it. Was hopeing to make it there myself next series.....obviously that isnt going to happen.

Has Ca or any other OFFICIAL shed any light on anything yet?

[GDonehue]

Pull your head in.Anyone can see Luke Madill would quickly cut his teeth and be a contender at a Worlds in 4x and is an exceptionto the rule.

We do not want moto fill

No argument - so stop being a drip - we all know madill is quick and deserves his spot (the guy is flaming quick), but if we are arguing the point about the selection process and whether it is following the criteria then it could be argued that he got a spot for the same reasons foxy should have

[barnesy]

[QUOTE=ronning;1041787]Firtsly llyod wouldnt touch graves... however alex possibly should have made the team because he rode well in the aussie series.
(rode well) YOU MEAN HE GOT 2ND IN THE NATIONAL TITLES, 2ND THE LAST TWO YEARS IN THE NATIONAL SERIES AND 1ST IN THE ONLY AUSSIE UCI (thredbo). AND WE WON'T KNOW HOW HE WOULD GO BECAUSE THE SELECTORS HAVE F**K ALL KNOWLEDGE ABOUT THE AUSSIE MTNX SCENE.

I'm not sure who barnesy is but the courses overseas are a fair bit more technical and having a good gate start does not get you in the team.Most of the picked riders have performed competitivley on the international arena.

I'LL BLOW OUR OWN TRUMPET (-something WE don't do).. STEVE HUMPHRIES, GEOFF CARTWRIGHT (DIRTZ TRAXN & TRAILZ) AND I ARE WHY THERE ARE 3 X MTNX TRACKS IN SYDNEY, 1 x IN GOULBURN, AND SOON TO BE ANOTHER THREE TRACKS! THESE TRACKS ARE BUILT BY US FOR S.F.A. BECAUSE WE ARE ACTUALLY INTO THE AUSSIE MTNX SCENE. THE TRACKS ARE BUILT ACCORDING TO WHERE THEY ARE LOCATED (PUBLIC TRACK - TAME, PRIVATE TRACK - SCARIER AND MORE TECHNICAL). I'M GUESSING YOU HAVEN'T EVEN SEEN OR RIDDDEN EBENEZER OR THE PYLET TRACK SO YOU WOULDN'T KNOW HOW TECHNICAL THEY ARE.

IF YOU KNEW ANYTHNG ABOUT LLOYDY'S RIDING YOU WOULD KNOW THAT THE MORE TECHNICAL, BIGGER AND SCARIER YOU MAKE THE TRACK, THE MORE IT WILL SUIT HIM. YOU COULD DROP THIS GUY IN 'SLOPESTYLE' TOMORROW..PLUS HE RACES. SO THE 'MORE TECHNICAL' ARGUMENT IS ALSO CRAP.

AS FOR THE WHOLE, 'INTERNATIONAL ARENA' CRAP, DOES IT MATTER THAT THEY THEN COME BACK TO AUSTRALIA AND GET BEATEN... ON THE 2009 WORLDS TRACK NO LESS!

WHAT REALLY SHITS ME IS THAT NO MATTER HOW MUCH I TRY TO PROMOTE MTNX TO NEW RIDERS, TALENTED ONES AT THAT. UNINFORMED PEOPLE CONTINUE TO TEAR DOWN WHATEVER GOOD WORK WE DO. WHEN A YOUNG GUY JUMPS THREW ALL THE HOOPS THAT HE IS TOLD TO JUMP THREW, SAVES HIS OWN WAY TO GET THERE AND TRAINS LIKE A BASTARD BECAUSE HE BELIEVES HE HAS DONE EVERYTHING. THEN GETS OVERLOOKED BECAUSE OF A BOYS CLUB!!!

WHY AM I STAYING UP TIL 2AM IN THE MORNINGS DOING PROPOSALS, DESIGNS, RISK ASSESSMENTS, D.A. C.A.D. DRAWINGS, FOR THE POWERS THAT BE TO BELITTLE THE AUSSIE MTB SCENE AS NOT WORTHY? REMEMBER THIS IS THE SAME MTB SCENE THAT HAS PRODUCED ALL OF YOUR DH CREAM. HOW ABOUT YOU PAY ATTENTION TO THE AUSSIE MTNX SCENE ALSO. YOU WILL FIND MORE CREAM!

I HAVE THE SHITS! AND AM YET TO SEE ONE LEGITIMATE REASON WHY LLOYDY WAS NOT SELECTED. WHATSMORE NOT ONLY WOULD HE HAVE HAD TO PAY HIS OWN WAY TO THE WORLDS, HE HAS TO FORK OUT A SHITLOAD OF MONEY IF HE WANTS TO APPEAL THE WHOLE PROCESS. YOU RECKON "IT'S NOT ABOUT MONEY", THAT'S BECAUSE YOUR NOT AN APPRENTICE PLUMBER TRYING TO GAIN SELECTION AND MAKE YOUR OWN WAY TO THE WORLDS, IN A BULLSHIT SYSTEM.

ONCE AGAIN MY RESPECT TO ALL OF THE RIDERS, IT IS THE SYSTEM AND SELECTORS I HAVE THE SHITS WITH.


P.S. instead of sending maybe 2 x riders that have a chance of a MTNX finals berth, how about you actually do your job, do your homework and send an entire team! You did it with DH but I suppose you didn't actually have to do any work there did you?

[the F.H.B]

Little mr ronning, Why are you asking anyone to pull their heads in? All I have read hear are considered, well reasoned arguements why the selection process has let our domestic riders down. I dont know who you are and weather your trying to play devils advocate or not but at the moment your coming more like devils arse, so take some of your own advice and ...

On the otherhand, some of your points have been quite well made but you ruin it with Stupid comments like calling the National series half assed, so a guy called Filip Polc traveled half way round the world to race in a certain "half assed" series and is having his best ever season... hmmmm...

As for earning your stripes overseas, why? If someone is a good enough racer they should be picked on merit, Weather it be Foxy, Lloyd, Buchannon, Madill, Whoever. At the end of the day if the sport becomes to eliteist it will decline. Most people cant afford to spend thousands on a bike then thousands racing the National series then thousands more racing overseas. And because they cant, the logical thing to do now will be to miss the National series and save your pennys for overseas.

What this means is that the skill level at the national series will drop, young riders coming through will have less to measure themselves against, therefore they will not improve as fast, therefore Aussie will be further from the top of the podium, sounds promiseing aye?

Roxy has already mentioned in this thread how it's disinheartening for her knowing that whatever effort she puts into the next series could now be for nothing, it doesn't take many girls to decide the samething and dowm, down, down goes participation...

[Squidly Didly]

I think it is 7 DH spots and 7 4X spots
7 is correct. The current World Champ, which happens to be Sam Hill, goes through by default. This means we will have all 8 riders listed on the track.

[ronning]

ok guys I can see your argument.

Just check all your statements before shooting your mouth off. Do you really know what your talking about??

I'm quite sure the team wasnt picked at the pub. There is a criteria which is followed. It is not decided on an internet forum.

There are people who unfortunately miss out and should be in.
However no one can dispute the past results of the chosen riders.

I'd love to mentioned those riders prove me wrong but there results do not warrant selection. No matter how sic they ride the ebenzer track.

many of the australian events are run well but ask any of our top riders as to were it sits those races sit on the list of there priorities ????

Why did polc to come around the world??Don't know probably to get some good off season training

[BOBCATZZ]

I feel sorry for rox and lloyd as they put there time and effort into training only to be shatered dreams oh whell theres two that could give a f@ck about next year.Half assed series i suppose it could be called that now .Seems it was used like a wigiegrub benefit a few and suck what protien is there then toss the rest .Also with a house full of bmxers if somone drops out then sharples can replace them with somone who never rides MTB wich i no as fact is on the cards .
Any ways to all those chosen good luck.
PS ronning your a dead set assclown

[the F.H.B]

Good answer ronning, nice to see you are reading our points of view.
I understand well and truely where your coming from, im just strugging to make sense of some of the choices.
Jared of course is a shoe in, but im wondering if there has been prior dscussion with riders nominated to do both events as to their willingness to compete in both on such a big weekend. Quite often at WC's we see several DHer's on the start list for the 4x but I can remember numerous times where they have pulled out prior to the Actual racing because they felt good for the DH and didn't want to drain their energy.
I am concerned that if they do that at the Worlds they are depriveing another rider the oppertunity to shine.

On another note, does anyone have any updates on Bryn's wrist? do they expect him to be right to race?

[BOBCATZZ]

On snother note, does anyone have any updates on Bryn's wrist? do they expect him to be right to race?[/QUOTE]AS I SAY A BMXER WHO NEVER RIDES MTB MAYBE WITH THE ENITIALS -- trust a ni@GER stay tuned it aint over yet i'll give you the drum

[Ryan]

It seems a pretty simple formula to me; if you want worlds selection, get out there and prove you can mix it up at the international level. Yes, Lloyd did pretty well at the last World's but that's his only real international experience.

Obviously not a lot of credence is given to Oceania's as it's just us and a bunch of kiwi's who show up to get smoked ;) Obviously not a lot of value is put in the National series because there are very few Aussie pros who take it seriously, as it's their off season.

Every Aussie on the team has proven over the years that they have what it takes to perform on the world stage. Lloyd, as yet, has not. Every Aussie on the team has risked a huge amount of their own money and given up a huge amount of their own time to get overseas, race and get noticed in the first place. Lloyd, as yet, has not. It's pretty obvious how the formula here works; race overseas and do well = get selected. Race in Australia and do well = not get selected.

Note that all of the Aussies with their "big dollar" (:rolleyes: Ha! Big money in MTB? Don't know which sport you're following) sponsors only have those sponsors because they took the risk in the first place and got themselves overseas to race. If Lloyd does that there's no doubt in my mind that he'll be in the same position in a few years time but ultimately, he has to make the first move and do something about it. No one is going to come banging down his door and shoving contracts under his nose just because he wins a few national rounds, the scene here is littered with riders with bucketloads of talent who never make the next level because they never venture beyond our shores.

Also, seriously, BOBCATZZ, post in English dude. If you can speak it you can write it.

[ronning]

Exactly what you said Ryan..that was exactly the message I was trying to get across.

Bobcatzz thankyou for your compliment

[BOBCATZZ]

Also, seriously, BOBCATZZ, post in English dude. If you can speak it you can write it.[/QUOTE]

SORRY SIR I WILZ GO TO SPECIAL CLAZZ FOR ENGLISH
WHO GIVES A RATZZZZZZZZZZZZZ.

[ronning]

Whats your scoop on Khalen??

[Ryan]

I give a rats. You can like it, or you can fuck off. I don't care either way.

It's just a shame because you do make some good points, but you have to wade through sentences that look like they were written by a 5 year old to find them.

[BOBCATZZ]

Well dont read it dick
LLoyd was never going to get in i knew months ago if Bryn rides hes a legand but i know who the reserve is.

[Ryan]

That would be option 2 then? Bye now.

[Daver]

Also, seriously, BOBCATZZ, post in English dude. If you can speak it you can write it

SORRY SIR I WILZ GO TO SPECIAL CLAZZ FOR ENGLISH
WHO GIVES A RATZZZZZZZZZZZZZ.

This isn't the first time you've been pulled up for spelling. It takes no more effort to spell properly, and it makes people read and understand what you're saying.

Anyway, IMO you should be racing on a global stage before you are even looked at for selection. Doing well inside Australia is all good and proper, but to be recognised you should be racing outside Australia. There are few, if any, riders who have been a pro from day one, meaning at some stage they have paid their way to race o/s prior to selection.

[GDonehue]

Although I don't agree with all of your points Ryan (there are some guys on the team making some very nice coin... not MX nice, but nice enough not to be begging for food), you have put it pretty much as it is. I am not a fan of the selection criteria, as it is certainly not how it is applied in other countries, so why here with such a strong local race scene (and I do not mean in terms of numbers I mean in terms of actual quality). I do hope Lloydy gets his chance to race overseas next year, as I believe he will do well and will make the 2008 Team.

[bmxbandit]

Alex is very good on his bike, and has lots of potential, but after seeing him at worlds last year he still has a long way to go be up to speed on corners, im sure he can rail a berm, but he was very awkward looking on flat turns, which is what i think Ronning is reffering too when he talk about a track being "technical".

I think he should have been selected but i can see why he wasnt, im sure if he went overseas to race atlast a couple world cups, regardles of how he went he would have been selected, just doing that shows a commitment that the powers that be are looking for.

It kind of sucks but thats just how it is, and im sure even Alex knows that.

[Ozza]

Sam Hills Birthday tomorow!

[Dozer]

It is obvious that the people who didn't make the team are disappointed, that is fair enough. It would be disappointing for the people who watch them train and race all year round to see these people just give up on the dream because they didn't get picked this time around.
Don't give up on your dreams people. If you enjoy doing what you're doing than keep on doing it! Some people won't notice what you're doing and how hard you're working but...............a lot of people will notice! Keep on pinning it.

Can people stop calling the Aussie racing scene "half arsed" please? There aresome people who put a lot of time and effort into making the best race they can available to the punters. We aren't made of money and we do the right thing wherever we can. If you don't have faith in the Aussie scene, get a VISA and show us how good you can run on the world scene.

I'm surpirsed that no one has actuall said "Fucking hell! Look at the lineup on the announced team! What a super high quality group of people we are sending overseas to represent our awesome counrty!".
Go Aussie.................world champions!:D

[barnesy]

.." Yes, Lloyd did pretty well at the last World's but that's his only real international experience."

YES, HE BEAT EVERY AUSTRALIAN THAT HAS BEEN PUT ON THIS YEARS TEAM (EXCEPT GRAVES/MADILL)

Obviously not a lot of credence is given to Oceania's as it's just us and a bunch of kiwi's who show up to get smoked ;) Obviously not a lot of value is put in the National series because there are very few Aussie pros who take it seriously, as it's their off season.

YES BUT OCEANIAS IS A UCI EVENT WHICH IS ONE OF THE STATED CRITERIA FOR SELECTION.

YOU ALSO LEFT OUT THE NATIONAL TITLES (WHERE HE BEAT ALL THE OTHER AUSSIES ON THE TEAM AGAIN PLUS ALL OF THE VISITING RIDERS ). ...STOP DOWNPLAYING WHAT THIS GUY HAS DONE BECAUSE IT SUITS YOUR ARGUMENT.

Also, seriously, BOBCATZZ, post in English dude. If you can speak it you can write it.

IN THIS AGE OF SMS SPELLING DOES IT REALLY MATTER?. IF HIS SPELLING IS ONE OF YOUR POINTS, THEN YOU HAVE VERY FEW POINTS. IF SOMEONE HAS PROBLEMS SPELLING IT'S PROBABLY NOT YOUR JOB TO HIGHLIGHT THIS. OR WOULD YOU LIKE TO REVIEW ALL PEOPLE ON FARKIN TO SEE IF THEY MEET WITH YOUR APPROVED STANDARDS OF SPELLING, VOCABULARY AND PROPER ETIQUETTE.

RONNING ...CALLING THE AUSSIE SCENE "HALF ARSED" !! IS THIS THE SAME SCENE THAT GENERATED HILL, RENNIE, KOVARIK, HANNAH, GRAVES. Yeah real half arsed. I bet the rest of the World wish they had such a 'half arsed' racing scene that produces such poor quality. Now we just have to look at the half arsed Aussie MTNX scene the same way they look at the half arsed DH scene.

MTNX IS NOT DOWNHILL.

[Dozer]

Barnesy, Ryan is an administrator on farkin. It is his job to tell people that they should not use SMS typing etc. You're better off finding that fact out now than later..................
In this day and age of computers with spell checking, it really leaves no excuse.

[alchemist]

YES BUT OCEANIAS IS A UCI EVENT WHICH IS ONE OF THE STATED CRITERIA FOR SELECTION.


Um, no.

must demonstrate their ability to compete at the elite international level by attending a minimum of two (2) UCI major races (World Cup, Maxxis Cup, NORBA, French Cup, Swiss Cup, Sea Otter) in the 2007 season prior to 9 July;

While you can get UCI points at the Australian Championships and the Oceanias these are not considered major races.

PS I think your Caps Lock key is stuck

[the F.H.B]

It seems a pretty simple formula to me; if you want worlds selection, get out there and prove you can mix it up at the international level. Yes, Lloyd did pretty well at the last World's but that's his only real international experience.

Obviously not a lot of credence is given to Oceania's as it's just us and a bunch of kiwi's who show up to get smoked ;) Obviously not a lot of value is put in the National series because there are very few Aussie pros who take it seriously, as it's their off season.

Every Aussie on the team has proven over the years that they have what it takes to perform on the world stage. Lloyd, as yet, has not. Every Aussie on the team has risked a huge amount of their own money and given up a huge amount of their own time to get overseas, race and get noticed in the first place. Lloyd, as yet, has not. It's pretty obvious how the formula here works; race overseas and do well = get selected. Race in Australia and do well = not get selected.

Note that all of the Aussies with their "big dollar" (:rolleyes: Ha! Big money in MTB? Don't know which sport you're following) sponsors only have those sponsors because they took the risk in the first place and got themselves overseas to race. If Lloyd does that there's no doubt in my mind that he'll be in the same position in a few years time but ultimately, he has to make the first move and do something about it. No one is going to come banging down his door and shoving contracts under his nose just because he wins a few national rounds, the scene here is littered with riders with bucketloads of talent who never make the next level because they never venture beyond our shores.


Sorry Ryan, I tend to disagree with what your trying to say here. from what i've been abile to ascertain many of the top Aussie racers (information is blurry on the interweb to say the least) got their international beginnings as a result of their preformances at the world champs, Rennie, Rando etc...

Even the funding required to do a single Norba or Wc season is massive undertaking for an unsupported rider.

[ja_har]

Sorry Ryan, I tend to disagree with what your trying to say here. from what i've been abile to ascertain many of the top Aussie racers (information is blurry on the interweb to say the least) got their international beginnings as a result of their preformances at the world champs, Rennie, Rando etc...

Even the funding required to do a single Norba or Wc season is massive undertaking for an unsupported rider.

So if that is the case the situation seems to be that if you are in Male under 19s DH you will get support, training and help along the way to make it OS with a focus to do well at the World Champs, The focus seems to be on building future champions but if you ride at any level of MNTX, (and XC for that matter) you won't get any support at all, even from the selectors when you are willing to pay your own way when you do have the potential to make it OS.

[...jim]

There are a few things going on here.

Firstly, we have runs on the board over many years on DH, so yes there is likely to be more funding for that in terms of representation at World championship level than for areas in which we'll struggle. It might not be fair, but that's often how sport funding works. Add to that the fact that XC is an Olympic sport, hence sits closer to the funding heart, and you have another grey factor.

In terms of riders paying their own way, that's certainly not the only cost for CA in this. Yes, we could send a full team of 7 XC men, 7 women, 7 u23 men, etc (or whatever we're entitled to across all diciplines) but it would cost a lot just in terms of team tracksuits (add other costs like accom? support staff? transport? team site @ venue costs). I don't know what it costs over all - or how the dollars break down - but it's going to cost CA (ASC, taxpayer, etc) more than just the cost of an airfare.

So picking the team is a balancing act that not only includes talent available (both in Aust or those internationals in a position to be there with support at less cost to CA, etc) - but also where the dollars run out. Unfortunately I guess(!) it's a funding fact of life that putting eg: Rennie in the Mtnx team will cost less than Lloyd. Unfair? Injust? Anti athlete development? or mearly a practicality of the costs involved in sending a team to a WC on the other side of the world. (note: no disprespect meant to Rennie, just the first name I though of)

I'd imagine (and I really don't know) that selection starts with realistic numbers that can go - before then moving to individual selection based on the criteria, then juggling the lot. Sharples and Grundy have the expierence and the runs on the board. There is also the appeals process, there for a reason.

At the end all the people won't be happy all the time.

[GDonehue]

Um, no.



While you can get UCI points at the Australian Championships and the Oceanias these are not considered major races.




This is where there is a little bit of confusion, I would suggest. The criteria states 'races that are seen as major' - but the UCI themselves see both the Aussie National and the Oceanias as being major and or at least major enough that they attract reasonable UCI points. I am not going to argue the pros and cons of whether or not this UCI ranking is justified - the simple fact is that in the eyes of the UCI the events rank. Who decides what is major when a result at NORBA might occur on the same weekend as say a World Cup and therefore have no ranked riders.

The other issue here is that the quoted criteria states two events that will be considered that have no 4X component (the Swiss Cup and the French Cup) and are questionable. The Swiss Cup has been replaced by the Zermatt Cup and is no longer UCI ranked. Strommy and Terry went there two weeks ago and got podiums, but both would admit it was not a really class field. The French Cup has no longer got any 4X... at least that is my understanding.

We have put in an appeal for Luke - it is based on the criteria and we'll see how we go, but one thing I would think is that with this discussion happening every year it seems we need a better criteria than what we presently have.

Oh - and other than this - YES, THIS TEAM ROCKS! We will hopefully see one of the most successful teams to date, with very strong 4X & DH teams and a shot at maybe three or even four titles (Men's and Women's DH, Junior DH, Men's 4X).

[GDonehue]

So if that is the case the situation seems to be that if you are in Male under 19s DH you will get support, training and help along the way to make it OS with a focus to do well at the World Champs, The focus seems to be on building future champions but if you ride at any level of MNTX, (and XC for that matter) you won't get any support at all, even from the selectors when you are willing to pay your own way when you do have the potential to make it OS.

That is a bit harsh, ja_har. The juniors over there are not getting fully covered or travelling for free - they pay too. Yep, they get support - our team is letting them use our vehicles in Europe, and they get the benefit of Scott and Beggsy - but if memory serves me correctly some of the guys in years gone by have had some nice bills at the end of the trip. The XC guys and girls are part of a supported program as well, so yes 4X has been the poor cousin, but on the same token you can only spread the few dollars so far and some of the top 4X riders are part of the elite BMX program anyway (Graves and Madill and I would take a guess that Buchanan might be part of something BMX driven too).

[Ryan]

IN THIS AGE OF SMS SPELLING DOES IT REALLY MATTER?. IF HIS SPELLING IS ONE OF YOUR POINTS, THEN YOU HAVE VERY FEW POINTS. IF SOMEONE HAS PROBLEMS SPELLING IT'S PROBABLY NOT YOUR JOB TO HIGHLIGHT THIS. OR WOULD YOU LIKE TO REVIEW ALL PEOPLE ON FARKIN TO SEE IF THEY MEET WITH YOUR APPROVED STANDARDS OF SPELLING, VOCABULARY AND PROPER ETIQUETTE.

RONNING ...CALLING THE AUSSIE SCENE "HALF ARSED" !! IS THIS THE SAME SCENE THAT GENERATED HILL, RENNIE, KOVARIK, HANNAH, GRAVES. Yeah real half arsed. I bet the rest of the World wish they had such a 'half arsed' racing scene that produces such poor quality. Now we just have to look at the half arsed Aussie MTNX scene the same way they look at the half arsed DH scene.

MTNX IS NOT DOWNHILL.

Yes it does matter. Yes it is my job to highlight people who aren't up to standard. Yes, if I don't think you meet those standards you will be taking a holiday from farkin. Any other blatantly obvious questions you need answered?

I also don't think you fully understand what I'm saying about Lloyd barnesy. I agree that he's fast and one of our best up-and-coming MTNX riders, but my argument that he still hasn't proven himself at international level stands. I don't believe that this is some vast conspiracy to keep Alex out of the team and I believe 100% that once he has proven himself, he will be a shoe-in selection for many years to come. He's only 18?, 19? now. Power athletes don't even start to peak until their early 30s, that's at least 10 years of racing once he finally makes the team.

For example, Darren Pokoj has made the semi-final of a World Cup MTNX which is arguably a bigger performance than Alex's result at the worlds last year as the fields at World Cup's are usually deeper talent-wise than the World Champ MTNX field is (for reasons such as DH riders being nominated then pulling out, which IS crap in my books). Still. I'm not going to get on here and kick and scream that it's a travesty that Pokoj isn't in the worlds team because "He totally had a big result a year ago."

You are wrong about the Oceanias thing too. The selection criteria actually states that results in major international events will be considered and specifically omits the Oceanias. It does however include a 'National Champion' clause.

FHB - The guys who you say got their 'starts' as a result of their Junior World Champs results all paid their own way there as well and with considerably less support than the current crop of juniors, who are also paying their own way, are receiving. I'm almost 100% sure however that both Rennie and Rando had earned contracts on 'pro' teams before they got their Junior World Championship.

[scbullit]

There are a few people upset about Alex Lloyd not making the team...
Does anyone know if Alex was asked to be on the team? I am told sometimes people are asked before the team is announced and they may decline because they can't afford to go or whatever.

[...jim]

There are a few people upset about Alex Lloyd not making the team...
Does anyone know if Alex was asked to be on the team? I am told sometimes people are asked before the team is announced and they may decline because they can't afford to go or whatever.

Good point. If I recall correctly, the reason we had no XC women at the Rotorua Worlds was that the three female Australian Commonwealth Games team members were offered a spot, but declined.

[GDonehue]

You are wrong about the Oceanias thing too. The selection criteria actually states that results in major international events will be considered and specifically omits the Oceanias. It does however include a 'National Champion' clause.



Not quite right (but also not quite wrong... see a pattern of inconsistency forming?)

2.1 States that the committee will only consider results outside of Australia that are UCI registered or those mentioned in 2.4. But, note here, the actual clause is not saying they will only consider offshore events, simply that if the result is offshore it has to be a UCI event or one under 2.4. I even had my reading of this paragragh double checked - it is just not really well written, but it is clear enough to be understood.

In 2.2 we have a contradiction - it states that the cut off is 17 July (11.1 says 9 July) and then we get down to 2.4 and find an event listed that is not even taking place until 21 - 27 July (Crankworx)... we are only up to page two and already things are looking pretty wobbly.

2.3.1 is quite clear - the selection committee can consider podiums. As there has been and is nothing to suggest that these podiums are specific to 'outside Australia' events, provided the event is a Major UCI meet (as per Para 11.1) it can be considered

Para 11.1 is where all the problems really come from, and it is this paragraph that an athlete could appeal on if they were only racing here. It states that a rider must display their ability at an elite international level by attending a minimum of two UCI major races - it then goes on to list these races, but the problem is the way it is written is done more so as a way of providing examples rather than a restrictive list.

This means - and I will be as clear as possible for the cheap seats - that the Oceanias and Nationals would and should be considered as events that can be used as qualifying standards. The Nationals in particular had stronger field than any NORBA I have seen this year and craps on some of the events listed in the guide.

Likewise the Oceania's MUST be considered a major UCI race, because the UCI considers them a major event (rightly or wrongly). We actually have no choice in arguing this toss with them, regardless of who does and doesn't ride.

My biggest gripe is the event list is dodgy:
World Cup - No Probs there.
NORBA - OK, on a good non-clash day you'll get a good field, but most of the Rounds carry no UCI points.
Swiss Cup... Jesus - Are they kidding me!?
French Cup... No 4X and the points are worth less than our National Championships , so why are they listed?

Sorry to get technical above - but having just written the appeal for Strommy, I have been jumping all over this stuff for hours.

It may sound like I want the criteria relaxed - I don't. Actually I want criteria that are tougher and would make it almost impossible to appeal because it would be crystal clear. We are a long way from this yet.

[TS153]

Id just like to say thank you to all the people out there supporting us with the little issue that has arisen, but doubt anything will happen with it and our best bet is just to aim for next year.
I also agree with GDonehue and would like to see a clearer selection criteria, maybe even a clear scheduele of races that riders looking for selection need to turn up to so we can get a decent comparison, Rather than having riders turn up to races and only racing if they think they think they have a chance, you either race 4x or you dont, pick. If you dont go good, suck it up and go to the next.
I also think that aussie races should be included in the criteria as so far racing in europe I havent been to a race yet that I have seen a marginally higher lever of competition. And too bad if its in your "off season", your a racer, so race.
Please dont take this as im having a go about certain riders on the team as im not they are awesome riders and rode with a few of them throughout the summer.
I just want to know what I have to do to qualify and not have to turn up to every world cup as I and many others dont have the money or that kind of support behind us, and I dont want to hear again that its cheaper to send dhers that race 4x cause its cheaper or maybe we should discuss a roster where one year we send a team of 4xers that will hit up the downhill, Id give it a go, id suck but ill try you never know I mite crash up top and rolly polly my way down the hill to a podium.
Once again thank you to the people supporting us.
Terry Scarr

[Techno Destructo]

IN THIS AGE OF SMS SPELLING DOES IT REALLY MATTER?. IF HIS SPELLING IS ONE OF YOUR POINTS, THEN YOU HAVE VERY FEW POINTS. IF SOMEONE HAS PROBLEMS SPELLING IT'S PROBABLY NOT YOUR JOB TO HIGHLIGHT THIS. OR WOULD YOU LIKE TO REVIEW ALL PEOPLE ON FARKIN TO SEE IF THEY MEET WITH YOUR APPROVED STANDARDS OF SPELLING, VOCABULARY AND PROPER ETIQUETTE.

Uh, yeah. It's his job. And my job. And every other mod or admins job on here if we feel like doing it.

Bottom-fucking-line: If you can't handle the standards on Farkin, then LEAVE. There are plenty of other MTB websites out there. I hear www.wheel-world.net is a happenin' place... go there.

Now, your english is actually alright, apart from the shouting thing you've got going on, but don't criticize us for trying to maintain a decent standard of posting on this site. You didn't pay to be here, it's not your "right" to be here, and we've been running this site a helluva lot longer than you've ever been visiting it for.

Geez. We're so evil... demanding that people actually put some effort into their posts instead of talking like they're on a phone or they're illiterate... How dare we?

[Tim]

yeah it sucks... i bet every country wishes they could send 20 riders.... When it comes down to it, 4x is one of those sports... any one of the riders mentioned for selection Alex Lloyed, Luke Madill, Jared Rando, Jared Graves, Luke Strom,
Bryn Atkinson, Mick Hannah, Amiel Cavalier, Kahlan Young, Terry Scarr and maybe even Michael Ronning have the ability to win a World Champ 4x. A slipped or unclipped pedal, the ever present unfortunate T-bone, miss timeing a lip...... whatever these all have the ability for the worlds best to get knocked out first round. Fact is the selectors have to do a job, wether it is some lycra wearing roadie who decides, just because he has herd or read about one name more than another choses, or it is Sharples himself who decides... Fact is all of those riders barring 1 or 2, has beaten and been beaten by all of the above at some stage or another. I mean really even if they put all the names in a hat and pulled out the team, they would still have a great 4x team. I would have loved to see some more people make it, but i also think the team they have is great. As far as actual "4x" experience goes they have a lot of it in this team. Good luck to those appealing i hope they can change the minds, but i really think there is no use in bashing the selectors... they have a hard job.... i know i wouldn't like to pick the 4x team.

Tim

[shauno/hillbilly]

Was talking to Bryn Here at whistler crankworx race yesterday and he has had 2 operations and has had his rist pinned.
think he may be rite for the worlds.
also SAM HILL won the Garbanzo Dh race today by 25 seconds with 14.25 justin leov 2nd 14.59 more results asap.it has been raining for the last few days and the track was a sloppy mess but fun all the same.

shaun oc:)

[Lloyd 371]

There are a few people upset about Alex Lloyd not making the team...
Does anyone know if Alex was asked to be on the team? I am told sometimes people are asked before the team is announced and they may decline because they can't afford to go or whatever.

I was told about 3 months ago I was on the team but it wasnt for sure untill july and then I was told I didnt make it.

I've been training so hard for the worlds, I'm riding the best I ever have. I should be on the team, I've worked hard for it and now my dreams are smashed. Anyone that says I shouldnt be on the team is a F##### idiot and doesn't know the difference between a good rider and a world class rider. I came 2nd in Australia, 1st at Oceana Titles and placed best at the worlds last year. What more do I have to do to prove myself. I cant affort to do racers overseas cause I dont have much money and Im an aprentice that gets paid shit.........

[Squidly Didly]

I was told about 3 months ago I was on the team but it wasnt for sure untill july and then I was told I didnt make it.

I've been training so hard for the worlds, I'm riding the best I ever have. I should be on the team, I've worked hard for it and now my dreams are smashed. Anyone that says I shouldnt be on the team is a F##### idiot and doesn't know the difference between a good rider and a world class rider. I came 2nd in Australia, 1st at Oceana Titles and placed best at the worlds last year. What more do I have to do to prove myself. I cant affort to do racers overseas cause I dont have much money and Im an aprentice that gets paid shit.........
It's a very sad thing to say but I wonder if the decision would be different if you had race shorts, a higher visor and mingled with different people. Politics are wonderful aren't they :rolleyes:

For the record, I reckon you should have made the team.

[scbullit]

I was told about 3 months ago I was on the team but it wasnt for sure untill july and then I was told I didnt make it.

I've been training so hard for the worlds, I'm riding the best I ever have. I should be on the team, I've worked hard for it and now my dreams are smashed. Anyone that says I shouldnt be on the team is a F##### idiot and doesn't know the difference between a good rider and a world class rider. I came 2nd in Australia, 1st at Oceana Titles and placed best at the worlds last year. What more do I have to do to prove myself. I cant affort to do racers overseas cause I dont have much money and Im an aprentice that gets paid shit.........

I'm glad I could hear that from the horse's mouth - so to speak. Shame you're not going - sounds like you deserve it. It's great that Australia has so many talented riders!

[GDonehue]

We just got the official word from CA. Our appeal on behalf of Luke Strom has been upheld and he has been added to the team in 4X.

[entombed]

We just got the official word from CA. Our appeal on behalf of Luke Strom has been upheld and he has been added to the team in 4X.

Great News for Luke and the team...

[MrCove]

go Stromy!!

and don't forget, Chicken Run Classic will still be here when you get back!